Thursday, July 27, 2006

Some Points of Clarification

1. I enjoy and appreciate those people, both young and old, that do not engage in the practice of gossip. If you want to know something about soneone...ask that person...not a third party. Otherwise, please know enough to realize that all you'll ever get is someone else's version of the person you are inquiring about.
2. I believe that the sinner is the one who commits the sin. I've done it. I am what I do. The person who uses a gun to kill someone is a murderer. The one who commits adultry is an adulterer. The teller of a lie is a liar. Any philosophy that says otherwise is simply a "wrong" philsophy. Accept responsibility for your actions. If you have sinned against someone, then only you can repent for it. No one else should or can do that for you. Ask for forgiveness and change. You'll gain humility and truth. That's why we need Christ even more.
3. I believe that everyone absolutely should not get married at a young age. We do not all mature at the same rate of speed. Just as some will never come to the knowledge of the truth, some will never come to a full maturity.
4. I believe that men should act like men and women should act like women. Quit trying to be something you were not created to be. If only leads to strife and confusion. After all, it's a lie.
5. I believe that God and His Son both taught us how to LIVE...not how to DIE. Quit looking for things YOU want to see and look for the truth. Don't be distracted, quit reading tripe and take dominion over the things that God gave you to take care of. Rapture Schmapture.
6. I believe that adults should debate with adults and children should listen and learn obedience, so that they can teach their children the same. Perpetuation of stupidity is a bad thing and it's hard work. Truth is perpetual whether we want it to be or not.
7. I believe that God tells us what to do and that we should do it and stop whining about it and making excuses. A brother gave me this example...If I leave my children in charge of the house while I'm gone and tell them specifically what I want done and they don't do it, that's when I get mad. I believe that by God's own actions, he is the same in that regard.
8. I believe that if I am hungry and want a meal placed before me, that I absolutely should not go in the den and pray for God to bring me that meal out of thin air. I live in a house with 7 people and we can all fix a bowl of cereal or cut a piece of bread. He put me in charge of feeding myself.
9. I believe that there is no right way to debate a "wrong" principal or theory.
10. I believe that no amount of lying can change the matter how long you lie and no matter how many lies you tell. You cannot mock God. He IS truth.
11. I believe that people don't simply need to "have a personal relationship with Christ" or don't just "need Jesus". To tell someone that, is like telling a starving man that he just needs to eat and be fed. He will quickly find himself starving again. Many significant events led up to Christ and all of those events are a part of history...HIStory.
12. I believe that many Christians are guilty and have become blinded by their idolatry...of the Bible. If you thing that the Bible is the source of all knowledge and truth, then throw away all of your other books and other publications, unplug your phone and don't leave your closet. You see, I can be as ridiculous as they can.
13. I believe that God's laws are forever...just as He is. They don't go away, just because we don't want to see or believe in them. If the speed limit in a certain area is 75 mph. and there are signs to indicate that that is the law, then we can choose to ignore that and deal with the consequences...from simply knowing that we were disobedient, to obtaining a ticket, to a possible accident which damages property, causes injury or death to you or another. The law is in place, whether we want to recognize it or not and the consequences of disobedience still exist...whether we want to admit it or not. Maybe we should be exploring law instead of spending our time worrying about when and how Jesus will come back to earth. His return and presence will be triumphant, whether he comes on a cloud or a 1972 Buick. Meantime, we have things to take care of. How about we focus on those things?
14. I believe that no matter how many times we ask, the person who sneezes in front of us is not blessed by God. If you believe in that, then go hang all the bottles you can find in your trees (the more colorful, the better) to scare away the "hants" (pronounced "hain'ts") outside of your house. Quit believing in superstition. God is not a phantom.


Bryce said...

In number 9, I am curious if your statement here would encompass high school or college level debate teams? The team is assigned one side of a moral or political issue that they must defend regardless of their personal convictions on the issue.

Bryce said...

Back again. This post sure covers a lot of issues.

On number 3, I would interested to know if there are people who believe that everyone should get married young.

On the one about having a "personal relationship with Jesus", I agree that this is a shallow, unbiblical approach. Jesus and the apostles never told people that all they needed was a "personal relationship with God" and everything would be hunky-dory. There is God's law, man's depraved failure to meet that perfectly just law, God's love and redemption in the sacrifice of his Son, which we secure by grace through faith. If it is merely to have a "personal relationship" as in God being your buddy, people won't understand how they can fit into this whole unfolding of God's purpose for redemption.

As you say, His-story is the true view of History. Instead of a linear timeline of dates and people, it is a glorious unfolding plan for this universe. I once heard that "uni-verse" means "one spoken sentance". "uni" = "one", and "verse" = "sentance" or phrase, as in "Let there be light" in Genesis. The evolutionists talk about the "universe" without realizing they are giving credit to creation. Anyway, I'll sign off for tonight after my rambling...

Arkanblogger Family said...

Hey Bryce-On #9 and your question on the debate team...5 very quick thoughts for now.
1. To learn how to debate is an aside from this.
2. For instance, I will most likely not debate homosexuality with a practicing homosexual. I will not cast my pearls. I won't waste time and energy. I must weigh out the point of the debate with other laws that govern our the law of witnesses.
3. What is the point of the debate/argument?
4. Is there common ground from which to debate? (christians debating abortion...vs. muslims and christians debating abortion).
5. Personal conviction is the weakest point on many arguments. See the law of witnesses.


Arkanblogger Family said...

Bryce-on your second post...yes there are those folks. My entire post was based on recent situations/encounters dealing with these numbered issues.

There are people who believe in "enjoy the wife of your youth"...literally for all. I have encountered them personally. Richard Wheeler is a "teacher" espouses this philisophy and the group of folks I am dealing with use him as a witness.

I don't have a problem with a God created evolutionary process. I won't throw out evolution just based on my fear, superstition or lack of understanding. What I will throw out is any philosophy that does not involve God as Creator.

I'm glad you rambled.

Bryce said...

"I don't have a problem with a God created evolutionary process....What I will throw out is any philosophy that does not involve God as Creator."

Would this include theistic evolution? I am curious then if you don't believe in a 6 24-hour day creation, and/or a young earth?

I didn't know that "Little Bear" Wheeler taught that ALL should get married young.


Bryce said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Arkanblogger Family said...

Theistic evolution is not a problem for me...well, depending on what definition we're discussing. For example, as wikipedia defines it-"the general opinion that some or all classical religious teachings about God and creation are compatible with some or all of the human understanding about biological evolution." I have no problem with that general idea or philosophy. As you know, there are those that like to continually try and re-define our words to fit their current whim. Multicultural and diversity and gay are three that come to mind immediately...for a later discussion around a fire in Montana in December maybe.

Richard Wheeler does teach that. He evidently thinks because he did it and is still married and because there is a scripture or scriptures that in his mind gives it credence, that it should be the norm. Confused and or immature people listen to that...and off they go.

Concerning the timeframe of the creation, offhand, I do not believe in a 24 hour creation. As for me, it is "supernatural" to conceive of it. I do not see where He works that way (supernaturally) today and I am also to understand that He is the same yesterday, today and forever. I probably don't believe in many things that would be along that line of thinking. Clearly, I do not have His understanding and if He wants to operate that way, He can. After all, He is the Great I AM. But I see no evidence of it in the science, nor the scientific laws which He created and set in motion at the beginning of time. Many years ago, I read other texts that helped to corroboroate 6 "ages", rather than 6/24 hour days and I have also looked to the spirit of the scripture "a day is as a thousand years to God"...and it does not cause me to stumble.

Bryce, one of the ways that I try and understand God and His relationship with us, is how I look upon and deal with my children, within the framework and boundaries of God's I understand them and see them "witnessed" and working through the faith and works of myself and other around me, both past and present.

I'm 43 and still learning and adapting (or trying to) as I go. We weren't born into all knowledge were we? As history goes, it wasn't that long ago when people were convinced to the point of killing others for believing otherwise, that the earth was flat.
I believe that there are most certainly other issues in our current time which we have the same lack of understanding and/or hardheadedness on.

I hold fast to the notion that as much as we "conceive" that we know and understand about the depth of God...we just do not. Although some reasons may be very clear to them, my children can't possibly even fathom why I require some of the things I do from them. They are simply not capable of it because they are not me and do not hold my position.


Bryce said...

Your comment prompted me to dive into Genesis and a couple of other passages. I have some questions if you don't mind helping me understand better where you are coming from.

If God does not work supernaturally, can we believe the many miracles through scripture? Or does science also have to corroborate these events? These are no more natural than creating matter and life out of nothing. For example, manna, pillar of fire, Red Sea parting, plagues in Eygpt, immaculate conception of Jesus, Jesus' many miracles, his resurection, the sun standing still, fire and brimstone, and the list could go on.

Is the reference to a "day being as a thousand years" located in the context of a creation passage?

As a last question, does your view of "origins" allow that death could have happened in the ages before Adam sinned?

I do agree that we can't know the mind of God and understand how he works, except for that which he plainly tells us in his Word.

I would like to come back to this subject after I have the opportunity to study it more, and then maybe I can explain on my blog how and why I understand Genesis and the other creation passages?

Sincerely, Bryce

~ Renée ~ said...

Maybe you could explain point # 12 further, about the Bible.

The Bible is sufficient in itself for knowledge and practice, but of course the Lord has gifted hundreds, if not thousands, of Christians to expound on His Word, in both preaching and writing.

There is a rich heritage of Godly literature available to us, which we would do well to make use of--all the while submitting it to and checking it against Scripture which holds, being the inspired revelation from God, the supreme authority over all other books and sermons.

For instance, I have been studying lately about creeds and confessions. It is expedient for Christians today to respect and make use of the interpretation that others have made of the Bible, rather than each generation taking only the Bible and determining their own view of it.

Again, scripture is the authority, but using the helps of other commentators and authors helps us to keep an orthodox doctrine and helps us to see things we may not have noticed; it aids us in understanding more, rather than starting from the beginning all the time.

Just as parents are to teach the next generation, writers and speakers can pass on Godly wisdom, and protect our heritage, by the above means of communication: confessions, books, commentaries, etc.

Well, I thought I'd comment on my way inside, from stacking hay. Hope you're all doing great!

~ Renée ~ said...

I thought I'd clarify something else I intended to say.
Of course there is knowledge and truth outside of the Bible, but all true knowledge is given by the Holy Spirit and all real truth is a reflection of God and the things contained in the Bible.

Consequently, Christians are very capable to share their knowledge and the truth they possess, through the medium of books.

Yet, since all knowledge and truth is a result of the precepts in Scripture and the Lord's applying it to our lives--if we did not have other books, Scripture would be entirely adequate for a knowledge of the truth.

Arkanblogger Family said...

Bryce-Briefly, if you look back at my comments, I qualified the "supernatural" one with, "I don't see" and "currently". I believe that God can and does exist and communicates on levels that we do not...can't currently comprehend. I believe that He operates for the most part and possibly solely through his Laws...the ones we recognize and the ones that maybe we don't...yet.

On your creation question, the creation scriptures would be Psalm 90:4 and 2 Peter 3:8-9. A couple of questions for you then. Do they have have to be in the context of a creation passage for you to consider them? In your Owners Manual for your car, if the steering column is mentioned in the chapter on seatbelts, do you disregard it or consider it? Do you have to know how an engine operates from "bumper to bumper" before you believe (faith) that it will work and use it (works) for yourself? Do you know every function of your automobile intimately before you get in it and drive? (I'm really running the car metaphor into the ground here)

I have not seen that Adam was the first man for many, many years. But either way it doesn't cause me to stumble. The spirit of the creation story and what comes after seems logical to me, without Adam being the first man. So, yes, I don't have a problem believing that there was sin before Adam because I think it's more of a "parable" to learn from, at least in part, than it is the literal creation story. I don't hang my hat on it either way at this point, other than premises such as, "everyone" coming from Adam...don't think so.

I do not take every word of the Bible literally. For example, "I can do all things through Christ, who strengthens me." You and I both know that in terms of the way we see things operate in our universe today and through the testimony of history, that statement is simply, not true. Try going in your office and praying for God to bring you a meal in the name of Christ. Make sure you bring some crackers to snack on while you wait for the end of time. Go to Three Forks and pick a river for God to part for you in the name of Christ. Also remember to bring your lifejacket and waders, so you won't drown.
Go and try to levitate your tractor in the name of Christ. Also bring several chains and a heavy duty hoist. You'll be needing those. Notice that in reality...God's reality, the reality and truth of Christ, that you had to have some works for that faith to mean anything.

How does Christ literally give you strength? He strengthens us through his confirmation, encapsulation and summation of God's directives/laws/commandments and through his being the "bridge" back to the Father, when we transgress. Without that, we have only ourselves and our own pitiful course in life.

How do you view the "vanity" of life, which Solomon speaks of?

Well, that's getting off the subject just a tad and a little more than "briefly". ;-)


Arkanblogger Family said...

Hi Renee, thanks for the comments, we were evidently on at the same time. Stacking hay? Wish I could help. Your weather is probably a little cooler that ours. It feels like the Gulf here. I do need to get off the computer and see my family but will get back to your questions and comments. Hope all's well there too.


Arkanblogger Family said...

Renee-well now I can't go see my family after reading your second post.;-)

If I understand your comments correctly, then for instance, NASA and the knowledge they have acquired and have put to work, came from scriptures???

That the particular truth of gravity and flight ;-) came from a centuries old study of nature and the corresponding sciences that were given by God, yes. But not ALL from scripture. Probably not even mostly from scripture.

So, in that regard, all knowledge and truth is not a result of the precepts in scripture and the Lord's applying it to our lives.

We study these things (truth and not) and make the application. That gives us the opportunity to glorify God through the law of faith and works, proving us right and complete by his standards...or not. Maybe we had the right faith (Christian), but the wrong works (abortion is ok). Maybe the right works (teach no homosexuality) but the wrong faith (Muslim).

"If you love me, keep my commandments" John 14:15

Be obedient. Do what I say. The same goes for my family. We show our love through our obedience. Obedience requires a choice. My children have a choice. They may choose to disobey and they are still my children. My wife has a choice. She can rebel against me, but she is still my wife...and I will not divorce her now. We have a choice.

I've read the book Mayflower recently and although I am certainly glad to be here, I question the intention of the folks that risked what they did in order to arguably forsake the whole of Europe. So many lives lost in such horrible ways. They could have just as well made another decision. In fact, there were several choices to be made. I see many similarities in our homeschooled families. We become insular...I believe, many times for the wrong reasons. I can elaborate later.


Arkanblogger Family said...

Renee-does the bible teach you how to cook a meal? No, your industrious mother and her cookbooks do that.

Bryce-We have dominion. We are in charge and free to do whatever we want that's right and good within the boundaries that God has established. That's what "free in Christ" means. When we transgress, we have a bridge back home.

The very notion that we are somehow God's folly is preposterous. God took the time and cared enough to tell me something as exact as to how to take a vacation and when to help others take a vacation. He also told me not to frustrate my children. In fact, he commanded it. I am made in His image and I am to care enough not to frustrate my children, yet my sin is to be part of some great unfolding of His plan. Not true. The sins of my children are not part of some unfolding plan that I have for their lives. There is zero congruency in that...because it is not true. Overcook it anyway you like. It's still not true.

I'm interested in your definition of humulity. Don't just recite scripture. How does humility work in your life?

As I previously stated, I'm also interested in your view on vanity.

Last night, a famous Arkansas sportscaster was traveling home from a golf tournament and crossed a median on the interstate and slammed into a man that was minding his own business and obeying the law. Both were killed.
Part of God's plan? Not at all. It is very possible for one man's transgression to have far reaching effects on another. That's why God gave us laws and commandments. That is why I asked you about vanity. Solomon saw it clearly. One bad thing that I do can overshadow years of good things. It can have negative generational impact. Happens all the time.

We have to uncover the road signs or law and re-acquaint ourselves and our communities and our country with them. That's our job. We're in charge. We have dominion. It's not up for debate.

A.D. HuarD said...

Number eleven reminds me of the metaphor of the house. Someone once said that the Mesiah was the last stage of the building and now it was a house ready to occupy. However, that house included one wall of law which has been torn down and trampled. The house is uninhabitable without that wall. Christ without law is ambiguous and law without Christ is mercilous and vanity.

Bryce said...

Dear Bruce,

I would like to say that I don’t have it all figured out. I am learning all the time, and being instructed and challenged by those influences around me. In this topic I will try not to appeal to science, or my opinions, but rather the Word of God that inspired by a God that cannot lie, and who is the source of all truth. I hope to not come across as argumentative or haughty, but merely as passionate about the glorious factual creation account of God speaking the world into existence in 144 hours, some five to ten thousand years ago.

Back to my first question. I do see that you qualified your “supernatural” statement. But the question still is, can we believe that the many miracles in the Bible actually happened? Was there a global flood?

Passages don’t have to be in a specific creation context to be considered, but those passages which are directly giving a declarative account of creation are to be considered much more important than some generic verse about how God relates to time. Yes, God himself operates in eternity, and thus a thousand years can be like yesterday when it is passed. But, there is time on earth (time was created by God) so through the entire Bible, God uses physical, literal time to give historical accounts of things that we can relate to.

I fully agree that every word is the Bible is not literal. But, unless there are other places in the Bible which make a literal interpretation impossible, the literal interpretation is preferred. For example, the Song of Solomon is obviously a poetic book, and should be viewed as such. However, when it says “In the beginning, God…..And the evening and the morning were the first day”, that is clearly a declarative statement which has no biblical reason to interpret any other way that literally. Evening and morning is a pretty clear definition of a 24 hour day.

Is there any biblical reason why God couldn’t create ex nihilo (out of nothing), in 144 hour time span? Is there something preventing it? And what are the best two reasons for believing in some form of theistic evolution? And when God started this lengthy evolution process, did he use matter that already existed, or did he create it out of nothing?

“The very notion that we are somehow God's folly is preposterous.” I don’t quite see what this is referring to. Could you explain?

Humility and Vanity. I am a little unclear on how this relates to everything we are discussing, but I will give it a shot. Humility is a lowly, state of mind without pride. In our lives, this means being yielded to God and fearing God. Vanity is the brevity, emptiness, and triviality of our mortal life. As you say, tragic things can happen.

I don’t necessarily want to get on a rabbit trail, but we are not in charge. God is firmly planted on the throne, ruling the universe just as he has forever. In Job Satan had to ask permission of God to afflict Job, and guess what? Afflicting Job was part of God’s plan, and the text actually says that God was responsible for taking away all these things from Job, his children, health, wealth, etc. I would be curious what Nebuchadnezzar would say if you asked him who is in charge.

“And at the end of the days I Nebuchadnezzar lifted up mine eyes unto heaven, and mine understanding returned unto me, and I blessed the most High, and I praised and honoured him that liveth for ever, whose dominion is an everlasting dominion, and his kingdom is from generation to generation: And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou? At the same time my reason returned unto me; and for the glory of my kingdom, mine honour and brightness returned unto me; and my counsellors and my lords sought unto me; and I was established in my kingdom, and excellent majesty was added unto me. Now I Nebuchadnezzar praise and extol and honour the King of heaven, all whose works are truth, and his ways judgment: and those that walk in pride he is able to abase.” (Dan 4:34-37)

See also Psalm 66:7, and 103:19, and John 19:11, just to name a few.

In Luke chapter three it has a genealogy from Jesus all the way back to Adam. It says Jesus was the son of, who was the son of, etc, until coming to Adam is says, Adam, who was the son of God. Adam had no father but God himself. He had no ancestor.

Romans 5 tells us that sin and death came into the world by Adam. And because of Adam’s sin, we all have sin, just like because of Christ’s life, we are given life. How does this change the gospel if we don’t have death/sin through Adam? Then we have to wonder if we can really have righteousness/life through Christ?

The very reason and basis for having a Sabbath day, is founded on God working 6 days and resting on the seventh. See the fourth commandment below. So we say that God didn’t really work for 6 days, then we have destroyed the basis for one of the 10 commandments which is the foundational, secondary law code of God (clarifying and elaborating on the greatest two commandments). Maybe if each “day” is a million years, then we should each work for 6 million years, then take a million year vacation. We certainly can’t take the commandment literally in its reference to “day”, so this would be an acceptable interpretation. Since “day” in Genesis means an “age”, then in this comparison in Exodus, we can’t switch the definition of “day” in midstream.

“Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.” (Exodus 20:8-11)

It is out of love for the eternal truth of God that I explain what I understand from the Bible to be His truth. The understanding of God who is self sufficient, needs nothing, holds all power, all knowledge, is perfection itself, who was under no compulsion to create anything, supernaturally creating the universe is simply awesome. There was only God in existence. He needed nothing. He gained nothing by creating the universe, except a canvas on which to paint his glory. And out of nothing He made Montana, Arkansas, the infinite heavens showing his handiwork, the infinitely detailed self-replicating molecular structure of the tree in your yard, all with the power of his word. He still upholds all things by the “word of his power” (Heb. 1:3).

I have much more to say, but I can’t spare anymore time at the moment. I am trying to meet a deadline for writing an article, on top of normal full time work schedule, and travel plans.

In awe of his glory and power, your brother in Christ,


Bryce said...

I want to clarify something that I said. When I said we are not in charge, I assumed that you were saying that man is in control of the earth, but I now realize that you may not have meant that. I do however believe that man has authority over animals and the earth's resources with a God-given mandate to take dominion of them. This is all underneath the umbrella of God's ultimate and universal rule.


~ Renée ~ said...

I was meaning and discussing 'spiritual knowledge', since I thought this was where you were coming from in your talking about the Bible versus other books that Christians learn from. In which case, I believe that everything I said, still holds true.

Now, as you mentioned NASA, etc, I'll add that no, of course the Bible does not speak about every fact that people have ever discovered. But, God gives men the ability to learn all that they do. And, any real, true knowledge (not opinion or theory) certainly will never contradict Scripture, which is completely truthful.

You're right that all general knowledge is not a direct result of the person's applying Scripture to their lives, because of course non-Christians can accurately know many, many things. But I would still say that all 'truth' is of God and revealed by God.

Arkanblogger Family said...

"Who is John Gault?"


Bryce said...

I am assuming you aren't asking me, because I don't have a clue. :)

Arkanblogger Family said...

Blogging for me is very similar to journaling. I like to write and to talk. Ask my family. I'm just sharing my journal here but I don't debate the things in it. Discuss them, yes, argue I'm just gathering a collection of my thoughts, beliefs and observations about life. Outside of the fact of my parents being divorced, I have a rich family history and have been fortunate enough (some may argue with that one) to know of some of my ancestors and even many of their experiences and I draw on that, along with my faith and my many experiences so far in this good life.

The last thing I want to do is enter into endless debate...about anything. I've been around long enough and have experienced enough things to smell that a mile away. I've just been being polite, that's all. I do get a little frustrated at all the questions. Don't know where that's coming from, unless you're just looking to debate issues.

Speaking of questions, the vanity and humility questions Bryce are for me to learn about you and see how much you understand...not how much you can repeat. It's very possible that at 19 years of age, you just haven't been engaged in life long enough to understand why I asked you that. And you know what? That's ok. It's as it should be...otherwise, why go through the aging process? Knowledge is quick and easy. Go buy a book. Understanding is where time, patience, a willingness to learn, obedience and some things I'm leaving out all come into place.

OK, there was something else behind the questions I asked you. That technique is just an interrupter that would cause you to take pause and to possibly drop your guard and/or take off the filter that you put your information through, knowing or unknowing...and stop the debate I've used that technique in conversation both personally and professionally for over 20 years now.

You made some good and interesting points, by the way. I just don't want to tell you what they are...right now.;-)


Arkanblogger Family said...

Google it. The question, I mean.


Arkanblogger Family said...

Ask Jack the Builder...if you dare. Let's see if all those vitamins he takes are having adverse effects on his memory. He'll probably read this and I'll be in trouble.


Arkanblogger Family said...

Bryce-The John Gault question reminded me of some of the conversation or debate that was taking place on my blog. That's why I asked it.

Bryce said...

Dear Bruce,

Thank you for your analysis. It is good for me. I appreciate you being honest about not wanting to debate. No need to be polite, just tell me.

Regarding debate, I try to stay out of "endless" debates also. The very few lengthy debates that I have been part of on my blog have terminated with each side knowing and respecting each other better and modifying some of our beliefs. I feel these are productive to sharpen a person, because if both sides present a case, both sides can learn from the other. With all that said, I will try not to presume to switch from a discussion to debate without testing the waters to see if the other party desires to. The internet is a poor media for discussion, because of the rather impersonal nature of it. I feel that it lends itself easier to debate (replying to certain points), but discussion is more profitable on the phone or in person.

I do want to mention that I am not just repeating sound bites that I heard somewhere. I am explaining what I see when I read the Bible. Also my line of questioning was to possibly expose from your answers, parts of my view that are erroneous or assumptive. As I said in the beginning, I don't know it all, but rather am learning from those around me including you. In this light, if you want to share more about your understanding of Genesis, I would be very interested in reading it, without debating further.


Arkanblogger Family said...

Bryce-first of all, I really do have a job.;-)

I'm home this week...half working and half painting, caulking, re-screening and a myriad of other things that would take me too much time to go into. A home is a chore to keep up with a min. of 7 ppl in it 24/7. But I'll gladly take it over an empty one.

I try and operate from the law of witnesses on what I accept as truth. Naturally, I have not made an inventory of "all" of my thoughts and beliefs, so some have yet to be checked out sufficiently. Hopefully those are limited to things like, whether cabbage has a benefit to the colon or not. But there are deeper ones, I'm certain.

I can get 2 or 3 witnesses from many sources. You know Bryce, I communicate with my children on many levels. I may leave them a note, I may read them a book or other text, I may use body language, I may use silence, I may use a shifting of my eyes. When I consider that and the fact that I am made in God's image, God's options of communication with me expand exponentially...after all, those are only the ways I communicate and I am not God. I don't have to go pick up volumes of books to be witnessed to supplement my position on whether being a "one cupper" when taking communion is good or a for instance or if infant baptism is beneficial or "wrong". With what I have acquired and been blessed with at this stage in my life, my radar doesn't work that way. At least universally.

Maybe that will further explain where I am.

And yes, if we were in person, things would probably be somewhat different, at least in our perceptions.

Back to the paintbrush...Bruce